How to Find and Use Your Voice

Happy Admin Month! Learn from guest Mallory Rothstein how to speak up and advocate for yourself as an EA or admin professional today.

Recorded at EA Ignite Fall 2024 and produced by the American Society of Administrative Professionals - ASAP. Learn more and submit a listener question at asaporg.com/podcast.

Leah Warwick: Hi, everyone. I'm Leah Warwick, and you're listening to "The Admin Edge." Happy Admin Month, officially. Here at ASAP, we are so excited to celebrate with you and share our sixth season of this podcast, recorded at our latest event, EA Ignite. Our first guest is Mallory Rothstein, Founder of More Than An Admin, talking with Mia Lane, Manager of Executive Administration at UKG, and an ASAP Advisory Board Member. Okay, let's dive into this conversation on finding your voice and using it with confidence. Mia speaks first.

Mia Lane: Were there some key moments or experiences that helped shape your confidence and your communication style?

00:00:50                     

Mallory Rothstein: So, I think that there's a couple. I think the most influential, for me, was having a mentor when I first started at Google. She was my first lead admin. Her name is Dawn Kinzie. I talk about her all the time because she's my absolute best friend now. That's how much of an influence she had on me. When I came to Google, she was very much like, "I have your back. I want to see you grow. I want to see you succeed." And she really helped me find true confidence in myself in the professional world. I always was somewhat confident, but really making me feel like she had my back – that was probably the biggest thing in really leveling up my speaking, from just speaking up in a meeting or being able to tell my executive something, to really realizing that I was special, that I had this voice that I could really use for the greater admin community. And again, she was very good with me, where she was honest. She said, "Now you have to take the first six months to a year at Google and just learn your role. Get really good at your role because, guess what? No executive is going to respect you if you stink at your job."

00:01:49

And so I did that. I shut my mouth and I made sure I was the best admin I could be, and then over time I got a lot of buy-in from executives, from admins who had been at the company longer, and they felt very comfortable with me taking more of a vocal role. So that was probably the biggest key to me, really, like I said: being very empowered and having the confidence. 

Mia Lane: What specific steps or practices helped you build the confidence to speak up in meetings or with your executives?

Mallory Rothstein: Yeah. So, I said that there's four steps. I usually do a very long presentation on this, but I'm going to keep it quick. You really have to – I'll say four and then kind of go into it a little bit. You have to 1) really know your voice. 2) I say, you always have to claim your voice. You have to execute your voice, and you have to adjust your voice.

And what I mean by this is a lot of people do not know their own voice story. We spoke about this a little bit earlier. You have to really ask yourself: Why don't you have the confidence in yourself? You have to really ask yourself: Why do I speak the way that I do? So, for example, for me, I grew up in New Jersey. My family is very loud. Everyone speaks with their hands. I'm super passionate. 

00:02:54

Now, if someone grew up in a different area – and this actually happened to me at work one time, where a manager thought that I was being super aggressive and that I was yelling. And here I was thinking, I'm just being passionate. But because we grew up in such a different environment, her voice was very different than mine. And how she saw being able to use your voice, again, was very different than me. So, you have to really know your voice and know your story as to: Why don't you feel comfortable? Or, why do you feel so comfortable sharing your voice? And I think a lot of people don't take that step to be very self-aware and really hone in on: What is their voice story? That's the first thing. 

The second thing is, again, you have to claim your voice. That means that you have to believe in it first before anyone else believes in it. I always tell assistants, "If you want to get paid six figures, if you want to be able to support a CEO, if you want to be respected by the admin community – if you do not claim your voice first, why should anyone else?" 

00:03:43

And so I always say that that might mean that you take a picture of yourself and you look at it. Usually when I do this presentation, I have a picture of myself that I feel as though I'm a bad-A, like I look like I am this boss – 

Mia Lane: Boss.

Mallory Rothstein: – on the screen. And any time I feel insecure, I look at that photo and I say, "I can speak. Look at me. I am confident in myself because I have an amazing photo." I also listen to certain music before I know I'm going to go into a big presentation, or I know that I have to have a really important conversation with a boss or whatever. So, I think that people really have to claim their own voice first, before they get the respect of other people. And then the third thing is: execute. So, you have to actually practice your voice. You cannot be scared.

So many people come to me and want to be better speakers, but they don't want to speak. They will do anything but actually get in front of anyone, and I say, "You can start really small with this. This could be just speaking up in a team meeting." The last thing is: adjusting. You have to practice and then you have to make sure that you get feedback. You have to be really making sure that you have the right people around you that can help you get better. You just make adjustments along the way. 

00:04:46

You're going to make mistakes. I say this all the time: I have made plenty of mistakes. I've had to apologize for things. I've had to go back and maybe say to someone, "I really didn't mean it that way, even though it came out that way." You're going to make mistakes, whether it's on a small scale or a big scale. And the reality is, if your heart is in the right place, then people will see that. As long as you really, again, have that self-confidence in yourself, you can get through anything. If I can get through stuff, I promise you can get through stuff. 

Mia Lane: Right. Speaking along the lines of confidence, people can tell by the way you communicate if you're confident. They really can. I know that you said that you have a picture that you look at. One thing that my father instilled with me when he was living was: Always know who you are because you are somebody. So that's something that I tell myself on a daily basis, and that helps keep me empowered to empower others as well.

00:05:41                     

Mallory Rothstein: Yes. I have almost like self-affirmations that I say to myself a lot of the times. It's really – for me, to do something like this, it is a process. It is not just like, again, that I just wake up and I'm like, I am ready to speak. Something else I tell a lot of people is: Have a pregame and postgame routine, just like athletes do. Because I'm at the conference today, I don't exactly have my exact pregame routine, but usually it's like I listen to the same music. I drink the same thing. I have a whole entire routine, and I think that a lot of people forget that, that you have to get yourself into this mode to be able [to]. And sometimes that's even just with a one-on-one, like I had a really tough manager one time that any time I spoke with her, I had to really make sure that I got myself in the right mindset.

00:06:26                     

Mia Lane: Right. Structure is always good, especially for preparation. So how do you ensure your voice is heard in decision-making processes, without overstepping in your role?

Mallory Rothstein: Great question. For me, first, you have to really, again, be good at your job. And you have to be very proactive in having conversations with your executive (or executives) that you support, in saying – so I used to tell executives: "How you treat me in front of others is how they're going to treat me behind your back. And so if you don't respect my voice, then they're never going to respect my voice."

00:07:01

I was very open and very proactive with all of the executives, so I would say, "I need you to allow me to speak. I need you to say that when I say something about space planning or an event, that you have my back. Let's deal with it between us, behind closed doors, not in front of the entire team." And so, again, I think getting really good at my job. I think also just mirroring, like how does my exec speak? How do they like to be spoken to (through seeing how other people interact with them)? I took a lot of mental notes, and I was just very proactive in these conversations with my exec because I'm like, at the end of the day, I never felt like if I didn't say anything to my exec directly, then I should not assume that intent, one, or assume sometimes that like – they don't even know that I want a seat at table if I don't say it to them. 

00:07:45

There was a lot of opportunities that I got solely because I just had the conversations with my exec. And again, you have to take risks. I think a lot of admins don't want to have to take risks. 

Mia Lane: They're scared, too.

Mallory Rothstein: You're going to come through executives that don't care. And I always tell people, "I might be the bearer of bad news, but sometimes the exec that you're working for, you don't have to last with them forever. It's okay to leave. You should find someone who respects you enough and your voice. As long as you're doing your job well and feel like you can be proactive, I think that that is a good stepping stone."

The last thing I'll say is, something that I've done a lot of is, through my own networking and through my own professional development (whether it's going to a conference or an event), I've showed them the value, so they really respect me because they see me like themselves. I always said to execs, "I want you to view me eye to eye, not looking down upon me, and I'm going to act like you do. I'm going to go to conferences. I'm going to network. I'm going to make sure that I mirror your actions." 

And make sure that – I know that even in the industry, a lot of admins don't even know anything about their industry. I say, "If you want to be respected by your executives, you need to showcase that you know not just your job, not just the company, but your industry as well. Even if it's something small, like you saw a company got bought by another company, say it to your exec: 'Hey, did you see this news?' Because they're going to be like, 'Oh, wow, you're actually keeping up-to-date on industry trends.'" 

00:09:05

I think that some admins forget to do those small things that actually gain a lot of respect by executives. And I'll say, specifically at Google, that was one of the biggest ways I got respected was because I really spoke to them about things that were not just my specific job related. I would talk about industry trends. I would talk about what else is happening at the company. And they would sometimes learn things from me, so they wanted me to keep talking because they were learning and they were finding value from me – even though I would always try to joke around, too, and have some fun. 

Mia Lane: Right. It's really important that you feel confident in speaking up to your executive. It's one thing that I kind of passed down to my team members: "You have not if you ask not. If you want a seat at the table, you need to advocate for it and own it." So, have you ever faced pushback or felt dismissed in the midst of speaking up?

00:09:57                     

Mallory Rothstein: Yes. So, I had one manager who, again, used to think that I was always aggressive. It's funny because it was another woman, but that's a whole other story.

Mia Lane: Yeah, okay. I get you.

Mallory Rothstein: And so, what happened was any time that I would challenge her, it was an issue. And I always said, "I'm coming from the place that I want you to be the best, because you expect me to be the best, so I'm going to try to [make] you the best." I think that, for me – again, this is why I tell people it is okay to leave. I had tried everything and anything to make this person really respect me, and I felt like at certain points – like you're in this toxic relationship. You've just got to leave. So, I ended up leaving this executive. I don't think that that is a terrible thing to say, because sometimes you're not the right match.

00:10:46                     

Mia Lane: Sometimes it's just not a fit, and you have to own that. It's really important for us, as EAs, to embrace and have a growth mindset. There are so many within our industry that may have been doing this for years, but they just can't wrap their head over having the growth mindset. That's an important piece in this day and age. In order to be successful, you have to be willing to grow and go through the changes, and pivot when you need to, and look at the positive side of things, not being negative.

Mallory Rothstein: And I'd say public speaking is one of the most important skills that I think every admin should have, because let's say your executive is sick one day, or let's say your executive doesn't want to host something. If you can do public speaking at any level, the ability to step in for them is a game-changer.

00:11:40

When I worked at Google, I partnered a lot with engineers. Engineers are usually very introverted. 

Mia Lane: Oh, yes.

Mallory Rothstein: So, because I was more extroverted at work, they would say, "Oh, you want to lead this team meeting? Or if you want these different opportunities…" because they knew that I would be willing to do that for them. I used to see some other admins that I feel as though they were like, oh, how were you able to do this? Well, I raised my hand and I told them that I was willing to host things. I was willing to put myself out there. They knew that they could rely on me. But so many admins get so scared of public speaking. They're like, "I just want to be behind the scenes," which is, of course, fine. But you should at least have the skill because if you can and your exec needs you for whatever reason, you will be valuable. You will be so much more valuable to them.

00:12:22                     

Mia Lane: So, were there any mentors or role models who helped you find your voice when you were executive assistant?

Mallory Rothstein: Yes. My two – I think I mentioned before Dawn Kinzie. Shout out to her, my absolute best friend. She was my first lead admin at Google and was really the one that made sure that I was set up for success there. She taught me everything that I know, pretty much, at Google, and I just want to give her a big shout-out. And then the second person is my second lead admin, Annie Chang, another amazing person. Both of them were – they were very good at not micromanaging, but still mentoring me in a way where I felt very safe to, again, experiment. And if I made mistakes, they had my back.

00:13:01

And I think that throughout those times – like on one team I was very supported by executives. On the other team, some executives, again, they didn't – we just didn't have the best partnership. But, always, both of them had my back 100%. I think that's really important for any admin to have is one person that just has your back completely and gives you opportunities. 

Like Dawn and Annie, they both looked for opportunities for me because they knew I liked to do hosting. They liked that I was okay being front of the house. They would look for opportunities for me. I think that that gave me a lot of confidence because these were not large-scale stuff. This was not a huge podcast. These were just, again, little opportunities. 

Mia Lane: They add up.

Mallory Rothstein: Yes, exactly. And then you get more comfortable. And I think some people think that you have to go from nothing to TED Talk-land. And you don't. Like, you literally just go from not speaking at all to speaking up in a team meeting, leading an admin team meeting, then maybe leading the leadership team meeting, potentially, for your executive. And it doesn't –

00:13:54

When you lead, for me, I used to lead – one of my managers, who was an engineer – his leadership team meetings. This is not me, obviously, talking about business revenue or anything, but I would say, "Okay, here are the agenda topics. Who's going to be the first person that speaks?" Sometimes I do an icebreaker. It was me just facilitating that conversation, so that my exec did not have to even use the mental capacity to do that, and he loved it. And then, again, the executive team looked at me very differently. They were like, "Oh, Mallory is the one that's hosting and facilitating this," so they saw me as someone that was really an extension of my exec, and part of the team. 

And these are things – again, it's not anything that's recorded. Some people get so freaked out if something's recorded, or they're going to mess up and it's going to be on the internet forever. It's like, you don't have to go to Step M. You can go to Step B and embrace that and learn from that. There's been so many things that I did, like one time I did a speaking engagement in California, when I lived there, at a library, and one person showed up. And I spoke to that person as if they were the most important person in the world, and as if it was 10,000 people in there, and it really helped me. 

00:15:00

I feel as though that sometimes people think they have to have huge crowds, and you really don't. You can just sometimes be speaking to one person and really helping you. 

Mia Lane: So, what practical steps would you recommend for an EA just starting out in their career, to develop their voice and be confident in their role?

Mallory Rothstein: Yeah, so I think that the first thing, like I was saying kind of before, is you really have to know yourself first. So, for example, I would not tell someone who grew up in a family that no one ever spoke up, that was in an abusive relationship and that was really scared to, all of a sudden volunteer for every single opportunity right away. I would say, "I think you need to…"

Mia Lane: Baby steps.

Mallory Rothstein: Yeah, baby steps. So, I think one is just really understanding where you are at. That's always number one.

00:15:48

The second thing is really listening and observing how other admins are and how your exec is. I think the third thing is really focusing on, like I said, knowing your job and doing your job well. I think the other thing is making the most of your one-on-ones with your executive, or however you communicate, really making sure that you are proactive. 

Even before I started working with anyone, during the interview process, I would straight up say, "I want you to know that I am looking at you face-to-face. You are not looking down to me. I am not looking up to you. We are on the same level." 

Mia Lane: We are partners.

Mallory Rothstein: Yeah, we are human beings.

Mia Lane: It's a partnership.

Mallory Rothstein: And I always say: "Utilize the admin community to show your value there, to show your executives that you have kind of this clout in the admin world to then bring to your executive team." For example, I think you were talking about this earlier. I utilize LinkedIn so much, and it helped me gain so much respect from my executives because they're like, "Oh, wow, like in your industry…" Not that I'm a big deal, but they were like, "Oh, you have a following. People actually want to hear from you on there." They see it themselves, so then they'd look at me, honestly, differently. They were like, "Oh, wow."

00:16:54

And then I had an exec be like, "How can I grow my LinkedIn? Can you help me with my voice?" And then you'll see, like again, when you do these baby steps, that you might get opportunities. One time, my exec came to me and said, "I want to host this career…it's called 'Tech Talk Series.'" And I said, "That's amazing. Well, who's going to be the host?" And he was like, "Well, you are." And I said, "Oh, really?" And he said, "Well, I know you like speaking. Would you do it?" And I was like, "Okay." So, I interviewed all of these vice presidents and these big people at the company, and I wasn't in an engineering role, but that wasn't the goal of the series. It was just to really get to know someone's career path. And my exec looked at me because he was like, "I think you'd be the best person," all because of these little, baby steps.

And again, you adjust along the way. You get feedback. You study other people. I used to say, "You've got to study your GOATs. Who's the greatest of all time for you? Who do you like listening to you? Study their path." There's so many times where I watch interviews now, or I listen to podcasts, and I'm really doing it as like a studying thing for me. Like, how does this person move through questions? How is this person opening and closing? 

00:17:55

You have to study people that you really admire, and that's how I've gotten better. And again, I'm not perfect. There's definitely times, even during this interview, where I'm like, "Dang, I should've said something differently. I wish we could go back." But you just keep going, and you learn over time that it's the accumulation of what you do, not just one moment. 

So those are some of the ways, the practical ways that I would tell people. And surround yourself with good people. You go to a conference like this and you get people that want to support you, that want to be there for you. 

Mia Lane: Right, have the same mindset.

Mallory Rothstein: The truth is that there are a lot of admins I speak to – and maybe this is too blunt, but I'll say it anyway because I'm from New Jersey, so I keep it real. There's a lot of admins who make a lot of excuses. To me, I can't tell you how many people I'm like, "Do this. Do this. Do this." And there's going to be people who are listening to this that I know that you're listening and you're saying, "Well, I did this. I did this. I did this." I'm going to tell you right now: Try again, or try it a different way, or leave and go to another company, because you might see a different result. I am telling you that you have to not have the mindset that there are all these excuses and life is unfair.

00:18:57

If you have that energy, it's going to carry out not just in your job, but other people are going to feel that. And I think, for me, I've been through a lot in my life. I will not go into all the situations. I haven't really spoken about this publicly, but I got sued for speaking up one time about my story, and someone in my life did not agree and sued me. And let me tell you something, when you get sued for speaking up – I always tell everyone that did not stop me from speaking up ever again. I won my case, and I told everyone, "I'm going to keep using my voice." So, you learn very quickly that even if your worst-case scenario happened, which I went through, I am telling you that it will keep going on. Do not keep on creating these excuses and living in such a scarcity, fear mindset. You will have opportunities. You will sometimes succeed, you will sometimes fail, but you will always get up and learn from it and how to speak better, how to make sure that, again, if one exec doesn't like how you're saying [things], maybe you have to work with another exec and they love your voice. 

00:19:50

That's what happened to me. Again, like at Google, I had one manager who thought I was super aggressive and then all my other managers loved it. They were like, "You're so extroverted. This is so amazing. I love how you use your hands when you speak." And it's just sometimes about finding that right match. 

Mia Lane: I really feel that transparent communication is the best, but not everybody can handle that. some people feel intimidated by it. Some people want to label you as having a direct personality as not being a good thing. But as long as your words are seasoned with grace and it comes from a good heart and you're professional, why not?

Mallory Rothstein: Yes. I'll say one thing to all the people from New Jersey or New York: We have a very different way of communicating sometimes than people from California or the Midwest. I'll say to everyone there that you be direct and be kind at the same exact time. And to everyone else: Sometimes people from New Jersey are going to be direct, but a lot of times we come with such a good heart. Just make sure that if you think that we need to be a little bit softer, sometimes we could be a little bit softer. The people in New York/New Jersey, or anyone that likes to be direct, also take the feedback that sometimes you do have to soften it based on who your audience is.

00:21:00                     

Mia Lane: Exactly. You have to know your audience.

Mallory Rothstein: Yes, exactly.

Mia Lane: Let's see. We have a listener question submitted by one of our community members. Their question is: What strategies would you recommend for admins who want to develop a strong voice in a highly hierarchical environment? 

Mallory Rothstein: This is a good question. The first thing that I will say is: You need to really know your place in that hierarchy. So, for example – and what I mean by this is, when Dawn was the lead admin on my first time – and any lead admin I had at Google – I used to say to them, "At the end of the day, you are the decision-maker. I respect you. I'm always going to share with you what I want, but at the end of the day, you are that decision-maker, and I have to live with that."

00:21:46

I did not complain and was so upset. I just realized that I did what I can do. The first thing is: Know your place and know what actually you have influence over. What can you do? Is it that you have to go through a certain process (whatever that is)? I'd say that's like the first thing. The second thing is, again, figuring out with your executive in that hierarchy of: Is your executive and you on the same page? I think that's another thing, is really focusing on making sure you are a team with your executive because – 

Mia Lane: Yeah, being aligned.

Mallory Rothstein: Yes, because then that executive can potentially advocate for you. And that's happened to me, like sometimes I did disagree with one or two lead admins and I would say to my executive, "Hey, I'm seeing it like this. Can you please help advocate for this thing if you agree with me?" Sometimes my execs agreed with me; sometimes they didn't. But you have to make sure that you are a team with your executive. I really believe that.

00:22:41

And then the other thing is just, again, thinking about what you can do and letting go of this idea that you have to always be in control of things, letting go of – just realizing: What do you have control over? Focus on that sometimes. There's so many admins that spend so much time and energy about, "Oh, I can't do this because I'm not the top admin, and I can't do that." 

That might be really harsh realities, but the reality is they're either going to listen to you or not. After six months or a year of trying, you need to take a break and regroup because you will burn out. I've seen this. Even myself, there were times where I was like, "Dang, I don't believe in this at all," but I realized it's too much. You're going to burn yourself out, and you really have to realize that you only have control over so much stuff. And then, again, maybe you raise your hand if someone, let's say, leaves the company that supports the CEO. Maybe you want to go for that job if you want to move up and have greater control. You can do that. 

00:23:40

But I think that if you're in this hierarchy, you really have to focus on really knowing what you have influence over, partnering with your executive so that you're on the same page, and just letting go of the things that you cannot control. Again, maybe that means that if you want so much control and you want to move up, that you go to another company where you support a CEO. And again, I know I keep on saying about like, "Leave. It's okay to leave." I'm not saying – loyalty is very important. 

Mia Lane: But you know when it's time to leave.

Mallory Rothstein: Yes. It's just like – I always compare it sometimes to being in a relationship. You know, deep down, when it's time to leave a relationship, when you have tried and tried and tried again and this person does not see your value; it's like, you must go. So, I think that some admins – the reason why I say it so much is because there are so many people that come to me trying to make this partnership work where it is clearly not working, and they're unhappy, and then it spills into their personal life, and that's a whole other [topic] I could go into. You don't want to lose your spouse or your best friend because all you're doing is bringing negative energy home from work.

There are so many different executives out there and different industries – all day, I've been speaking to people and talking about how you can really find a different admin role at so many different companies and industries, like supporting a solo entrepreneur is very different than supporting someone at a Fortune 500 company. Supporting a CEO is different than supporting a director. Supporting someone that it's their first admin versus someone that's had five admins. 

00:24:57

All of that is so different, and you really can find the right fit. It's having that mindset that you can find it. That's something that – again, we talk about self-confidence. It's having that belief that you even deserve a good partnership. Like some people are burnt out that they're like, "Is this even a thing?" It is. I've had incredible partnerships with certain executives who I would work with in a heartbeat next because of how much they treated me and respected me. 

Mia Lane: They treated you like you were worthy of the seat at the table that they gave you.

Mallory Rothstein: Yes. And you know what I'll say is, again, I think I took that table sometimes – like I took that seat. I actually had an SVP in my first job where I was kind of sitting outside of the table and she looked at me and she said, "Mallory, if you're going to be in the room, you better be at the table." And she took the chair. It was such a powerful thing to me. I think that sometimes, again, admins have to realize [that] even that physical move of like sitting at the table – again, I wasn't doing anything bad. I was just moving a chair.

00:25:53

It really, for me, was like, "Oh, wow. I do deserve this." And then, when I came into my second company, at Google, I was like, "I'm going to really establish myself right away that I deserve this." And for all the people that – I have some people that are like, "Well, I already work at the company and I didn't do that right away." Okay, well, then just level set. There were times where I had to tell certain executives, "Hey, we didn't start something a certain way, but I need to level set with you. We're going to rewind it back as if we're first working together, and I think we need to redo some stuff." 

Mia Lane: Awesome. You know, Mallory, it has been great talking with you here today, and we are so grateful that you joined us here at "The Admin Edge." Tell me, where can our listeners find you online?

Mallory Rothstein: Oh, man. If you search my name, you can probably find me in too many places. I'm most active on LinkedIn and Instagram @malloryismore or @morethananadmin. You can find me at www.morethananadmin.com or www.malloryismore.com. Again, if you find my name somewhere, Mallory Rothstein, I promise you that you will have more places to connect with me than you probably want, and I'm happy to connect with anyone that wants to just chat more about finding and sharing the voice within you, because everyone deserves a voice.

00:27:02

I really believe admins could be really influential on this world. We know this, and I want to see more admins who want to have a voice be able to have one and be very self-confident in it. So, thanks for having me to talk about this. 

Mia Lane: Great, thanks.

[music playing]

Leah Warwick: Thank you for listening to "The Admin Edge," produced by the American Society of Administrative Professionals, original music and audio editing by Warwick Productions, with video and audio production at our events by 5Tool Productions. If you like this podcast, please leave us a nice review, five stars, and subscribe. If you'd like to submit a listener question, you may do so on our website at ASAPorg.com/podcast.